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http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/trump-transgender-military/index.html
"Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail." Pretty fair point tbh. I know liberals really know no limits to forcing their ideals down other people's throats at every medium, but if there's one place political correctness doesn't belong it's in national security. You can't expect the taxpayer and the safety of the nation to suffer because feelings.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/trump-transgender-military/index.html"Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail." But the taxpayers have to suffer to fund Trump's vacations instead. Right.
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LightSnake posted...
Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. A trans presence equals bad morale for military personnel who believe they are crazy people or resent being pressured into using "correct" pronouns etc.
Currently playing Marvel Heroes (free to play action RPG), Gears of War 3 and Dead or Alive 5
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cyric79's grandfather posted in the 50's...
LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members.
Green Bay Packers 12-7 Fire Ted Thompson
Seattle Sounders 4-5-4 16pts MLS Champions |
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Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members
There is some in the article, but that's like being against aviation security even though there have been no accidents. You don't wait for problems to start taking measures. It's called prevention. But the taxpayers have to suffer to fund Trump's vacations instead. Right Hey if it was up to me the whole nonsense around presidents and leaders would be abolished. It's nothing but problems. But tbf I'm sure you had no problem paying for Obama's vacations. Remember when Trump said he was pro-LGBT? Lol. I'm pro-beef. I love the stuff and would fight for it to be protected. That doesn't mean I have to put it in my ice cream though. You can support something while still acknowledging it has weaknesses and isn't appropriate in certain places. Supporting it doesn't mean blindly turning away from all its problems to make it seem better.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans |
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cyric79 posted...
LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. Source? Because the same thing has been claimed about black people 70 years ago.
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600k posted...
cyric79 posted...LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. Blacks were never diagnosed with staggering rates of mental illness or suicide though.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members There have been loads of aviation accidents. That's the reason the security exists. |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
600k posted...cyric79 posted...LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. No, they were diagnosed as being subhuman by racist scientists.
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DeroIin posted...
1Y2i3m0d posted...http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/trump-transgender-military/index.html"Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail." Also paying for our servicemen's Viagra, which costs more per year than the annual cost of treatment for transgender military personnel. Seriously, why do they even need that much Viagra? I thought the general practice was masturbating in the bunk, not actually going out and having sex with other people on a regular basis.
"Mjolnir: apply directly to the forehead."
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
600k posted...cyric79 posted...LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. https://www.nimh.nih.gov/images/stats/nsduh-smi-2015-graph-020317_154208_1.png |
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There have been loads of aviation accidents. That's the reason the security exists.
Some level of security always exists despite the prevalence of accidents. That's the point. They're coming out with new security measures everyday in aviation and other areas, and nobody ever really says its not worth it because it has never caused an accident before. As I said the theory is prevention over treatment. If you know something poses a significant risk you control it. No, they were diagnosed as being subhuman by racist scientists. Which would've had nothing to do with their ability to serve in the military. Yeah people were afraid of them and their bathroom diseases which they thought they carried. It was all completely unfounded, over the top racism and ignorance. Nobody denies that. That's why we've learned from the mistakes of yesterday and look at things a lot more sensibly and logically now. Eg, we've realized that there's no functional risk of letting whites and blacks use the same bathroom. It as just fear mongering. Science dispelled that idea, so we've adjusted our laws and customs accordingly. We know that transgenders within the military can and do pose issues for themselves and those around them, which is why we have regulations like this. Amd while those issues exist, so do the regulations. If they were alleviated to a reasonable degree then nobody would really give a f*** about them being in the military or not, but as it stands people do give a f*** because it would effect them in some way. Also paying for our servicemen's Viagra, which costs more per year than the annual cost of treatment for transgender military personnel. So you have a problem with the people protecting your borders being able to have sex? The need for sex enhancing drugs will always exist, and would benefit trans people as well if they were entitled to it within the military. That we spend a lot of money on Viagra for our cis gender soldiers is not an argument against cis gender soldiers, and it's certainly not one in favor of transgenders. That's like saying a zoo spends money to feed their lions, so they should get a bear instead.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans |
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LightSnake posted...
Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. The original article announcing it also stated that they were doing a member purge of enlisted soldiers who "are not medically fit for deployment" So... it sounds like the transgenders won't be the only ones.
Meet Captain Euro, the coolest superhero this side of Aquaman!~~Portal of Evil
[Disillusioned Independent] |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
There have been loads of aviation accidents. That's the reason the security exists. Which do you think came first? The first air accident or air security? Your comparison was terrible. Deal with it |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...
There have been loads of aviation accidents. That's the reason the security exists. Just ask him to repeat the point instead of pretending like you understood it.
The case against Clevinger was open and shut. The only thing missing was something to charge him with.
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SpawnShadow posted...
DeroIin posted...1Y2i3m0d posted...http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/politics/trump-transgender-military/index.html"Our military must be focused on decisive and overwhelming victory and cannot be burdened with the tremendous medical costs and disruption that transgender in the military would entail." BTW, the only people who need viagra are people with no business being in the military-- people with serious nervous system, circulatory disorders, or people who are on certain categories of antidepressants such as SRIs. It's either that or the military is using it for unproven off-label uses, such as preventing altitude sickness. Also, there is rampant sex between soldiers and between soldiers and the local population. There is a reason why the prostitution business has boomed whenever there is a war or occupation, at least since the days of Lincoln.
Meet Captain Euro, the coolest superhero this side of Aquaman!~~Portal of Evil
[Disillusioned Independent] |
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Hyena 20 posted...
LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. So, how many enlisted women are we talking about here?
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Why would the women suffer from gender-specific conditions that make them un-deployable? The only one I can think of is pregnancy, and that one will already get you kicked out.
No, the stuff that we are talking about with "non-deployable" would be mental illness, chronic musculo-skeletal injuries, auto-immune disorders, diabetes, and other chronic health conditions that developed DURING their service (any of those conditions bar you from enlistment) A basic rule of enlistment generally is that "if you need daily medication in order to function, then you are not eligible for enlistment, because during deployment, we cannot guarantee access to these medications" Something like vitamins/iron pills would not count as you can survive/function for a few weeks without them, but supplements for electrolytes to maintain blood levels of potassium or magnesium levels would.
Meet Captain Euro, the coolest superhero this side of Aquaman!~~Portal of Evil
[Disillusioned Independent] |
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Hyena 20 posted...
Why would the women suffer from gender-specific conditions that make them un-deployable? The only one I can think of is pregnancy, and that one will already get you kicked out. Because military life isn't just about mental capability, it involves an awful lot of physical work, and men are simply better suited for this kind of work than women. That is why there are zero women wearing a trident or a ranger tab. Oh and speaking of mental problems... http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-female-veteran-suicide-20150608-story.html#page=1 Edit: Excerpt Suicide rate among male vets is 60% higher than among men who never served Suicide rate among female vets is 452% higher than among women who never served
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600k posted...
Hyena 20 posted...Why would the women suffer from gender-specific conditions that make them un-deployable? The only one I can think of is pregnancy, and that one will already get you kicked out. You might want to look at countries with female soldiers. Like the pershmerga.Hyena 20 posted... LightSnake posted...Still waiting for evidence our military ever suffered thanks to LGBT members. The military regularly discharges soldiers who are no longer fit for service. Make no mistake, this is ALL about discharging good, capable personnel simply because they're trans.
"The US military is not an effective proxy for humanity" ~ Folding Ideas
Faciendere id pro RAVz |
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Peshmerga? We are not talking about people living in a third world region who are fighting for their own freaking survival. We are talking about people living in a first world country who are voluntarily enlisting and obviously not coping with the experience of mlitary service (especially overseas) very well.
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600k posted...
Peshmerga? We are not talking about people living in a third world region who are fighting for their own freaking survival. We are talking about people living in a first world country who are voluntarily enlisting and obviously not coping with the experience of mlitary service (especially overseas) very well. Fighting for your own survival is more stressful, brain trust. Women soldiers have proven themselves time and time again. But hey, I'm sure that the commonality of command rape in american military would have nothing to do with the mental health of female american soldiers.
"The US military is not an effective proxy for humanity" ~ Folding Ideas
Faciendere id pro RAVz |
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600k posted...
Hyena 20 posted...Why would the women suffer from gender-specific conditions that make them un-deployable? The only one I can think of is pregnancy, and that one will already get you kicked out. So what you're saying is that even with the 452% increase, women suicide rate is still lower showing overall greater mental stability amongst servicemen. Also a bullet doesn't care if you're a woman or a man. The effect is the same. Brute strength of an individual has never mattered in today's wars. Keep peddling your bulls*** sexist views though.
Bell Maiden is my waifu.
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davishippo posted...
600k posted...Hyena 20 posted...Why would the women suffer from gender-specific conditions that make them un-deployable? The only one I can think of is pregnancy, and that one will already get you kicked out. Typical dumb SJW response by someone who cannot even analyze some simple statistics and keeps ignoring any empirical data because it doesn't match his/her limited mindset. Well here is another link for you before being put on ignore, might be a waste but worth a try http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/09/10/439190586/marine-corps-study-finds-all-male-combat-units-faster-than-mixed-units
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the final bahamut posted...
600k posted...Peshmerga? We are not talking about people living in a third world region who are fighting for their own freaking survival. We are talking about people living in a first world country who are voluntarily enlisting and obviously not coping with the experience of mlitary service (especially overseas) very well. Rape in the military would be one more reason to reduce the number of women serving. Apparently men cannot be discouraged by existing laws to commit rape anyway.
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600k posted...
the final bahamut posted...600k posted...Peshmerga? We are not talking about people living in a third world region who are fighting for their own freaking survival. We are talking about people living in a first world country who are voluntarily enlisting and obviously not coping with the experience of mlitary service (especially overseas) very well. Except men are the vast majority of rape victims in the military. Time to ban all men from serving!
TheRock ~ I had a name, my father called me Blues.
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TheRock1525 posted...
600k posted...the final bahamut posted...600k posted...Peshmerga? We are not talking about people living in a third world region who are fighting for their own freaking survival. We are talking about people living in a first world country who are voluntarily enlisting and obviously not coping with the experience of mlitary service (especially overseas) very well. And that's why the suicide rate among women veterans is over 5 times higher than the suicide rate among women who have never served. They must have been traumatized by reading statistics about male on male rape cases in the military.
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600k posted...
That is why there are zero women wearing a trident or a ranger tab. What do you know, your npr post showed a related article proves you wrong. http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/08/21/433482186/first-female-soldiers-graduate-from-army-ranger-school
Bell Maiden is my waifu.
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knutjob posted...
1Y2i3m0d posted...There have been loads of aviation accidents. That's the reason the security exists. Erm no, just because you don't understand something doesn't mean it's stupid. You still don't get the fact that prevention is better than treatment and always has been. And yeah, air security has been around in some form even before incidents occured. Granted it was very loose and dodgy, which cost us a lot of lives,which is exactly why we learned to not take such stupid risks anymore. Like just because killer bees have never bought down an airplane, you still cant bring killer bees into the c***pit. Logic dictates it's dangerous,so we ban it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans |
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That zoo analogy was really terrible. Zoos have lions because there is a higher demand for exotic animals like lions to watch. At least in the US. In Zimbabwe, having bears in zoos may be more exciting than lions though.
Also there was no air security whatsoever when the Wright Bros. were experimenting with their planes. They were learning by doing and they had to learn fast because flying your own, unsafe plane would be suicidal. The knowledge they gained from flying their planes was later used by themselves and others to build better, safer planes.
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The mental illnesses argument makes no sense; even if you believe the rates are higher, people are already banned for that. There is no reason to introduce a blanket ban against trans people because of it. If they can pass the usual physical and mental screenings, there's no reason they shouldn't be allowed to serve (some cis people crying about it is not a valid reason)
~Hivebent4Life
3DS FC: 5069-3910-2647 |
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600k posted...
Also, are transgender people who are currently serving in danger of getting dishonorably discharged? They better not, because the cost of replacing those soldier/sailors/airmen absolutely destroys the cost of their treatment. Like, it's not even in the same ballpark.
Democracy is a theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it, good and hard.
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How many people do you think there are in the military that have a problem with trans soldiers versus those who just see them as fellow human beings. What will happen to the morale of those non-bigoted soldiers when they start seeing competent and capable soldiers who had their back booted out?
Trolling is not an etiquite issue. It is harassment.
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Bradley Manning's leaks led to the Arab Spring and ISIS.
I don't know, man, maybe 31genders is 29 too many for the military.
REFUGEES WELCOME!
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/408- |
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ShroomKingJr posted...
Chelsea Manning's leaks led to the Arab Spring and ISIS. The vast majority of trans people identify as either male or female though And I thought it was Obama who caused the Arab Spring and ISIS? You right wingers need to make up your mind
~Hivebent4Life
3DS FC: 5069-3910-2647 |
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Obama's actions were secret and he would gave gotten away with it too if it wasn't for that meddling Manning.
REFUGEES WELCOME!
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/408- |
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hivebent4life posted...
ShroomKingJr posted...Chelsea Manning's leaks led to the Arab Spring and ISIS. How sly of you to change his name to Chelsea in your quote. You know what it really comes down to? The ability to deploy. If people want to have sex change surgery they won't be able to deploy to a combat zone until they are fully recovered. They will be taken out of the fight for years possibly. Why would the military want to invest all that time and money into training someone, when they won't get any return on investment? |
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1Y2i3m0d posted...I'm pro-beef. I love the stuff and would fight for it to be protected. That doesn't mean I have to put it in my ice cream though. You can support something while still acknowledging it has weaknesses and isn't appropriate in certain places. Supporting it doesn't mean blindly turning away from all its problems to make it seem better.
This is the worst analogy I've ever seen. Carlos Mencia has stolen better analogies than this.
You know you have nothing when you start comparing people to food.crs1989 posted...hivebent4life posted...
ShroomKingJr posted...
Chelsea Manning's leaks led to the Arab Spring and ISIS.
I don't know, man, maybe 31genders is 29 too many for the military.
The vast majority of trans people identify as either male or female though
And I thought it was Obama who caused the Arab Spring and ISIS? You right wingers need to make up your mind
How sly of you to change his name to Chelsea in your quote.
You know what it really comes down to? The ability to deploy. If people want to have sex change surgery they won't be able to deploy to a combat zone until they are fully recovered. They will be taken out of the fight for years possibly. Why would the military want to invest all that time and money into training someone, when they won't get any return on investment?
What about trans people who are already fully transitioned? What about trans people who don't plan on transitioning? No matter what you think, you have to agree that a blanket ban on all trans people is pointless.~Hivebent4Life
3DS FC: 5069-3910-2647Fully transitioned people prefer to be addressed according to the gender they transitioned to. Bradley Manning hasn't fully transitioned and I don't even know if he ever will.
But I don't know why his name has been brought up, he did the leak long before he decided to switch, so his gender is really irrelevant here. He risked his life and freedom to expose US military war crimes (and many more ugly things), that's all what matters.600k600k posted...Fully transitioned people prefer to be addressed according to the gender they transitioned to. Bradley Manning hasn't fully transitioned and I don't even know if he ever will.
But I don't know why his name has been brought up, he did the leak long before he decided to switch, so his gender is really irrelevant here. He risked his life and freedom to expose US military war crimes (and many more ugly things), that's all what matters.
All transgender people prefer to be addressed as the gender they identify with. Her name is Chelsea. In fact I'm pretty sure she has changed her legal name to that~Hivebent4Life
3DS FC: 5069-3910-2647600k posted...But I don't know why his name has been brought up, he did the leak long before he decided to switch, so his gender is really irrelevant here. He risked his life and freedom to expose US military war crimes (and many more ugly things), that's all what matters.
We both know that Manning's story would not have gotten nearly as much traction in left-leaning and progressive press outlets if he didn't start to transition while in prison, and I don't think Obama would have commuted the sentence if he wasn't trans.REFUGEES WELCOME!
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/408-Also there was no air security whatsoever when the Wright Bros. were experimenting with their planes
The spawn of commercial aviation bought about basic security measures. You couldn't just walk in a flight on at will.
But since you're still having trouble with this, let me use a different example. Guidelines on food additives exist because we know they can be toxic in certain doses. Although there have been no deaths reported from most of them, we still keep limits in place. Why? Prevention and safety. We identify a risk and take a what-if approach to be safe.
A giraffe has never escaped from the zoo and wrecked havoc, yet they're still enclosed and tightly monitored just in case. There's a risk of it happening so we eliminate that risk just to be safe.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHNzgNBiSK0
<3 of the Balkans1Y2i3m0d posted...Also there was no air security whatsoever when the Wright Bros. were experimenting with their planes
The spawn of commercial aviation bought about basic security measures. You couldn't just walk in a flight on at will.
But since you're still having trouble with this, let me use a different example. Guidelines on food additives exist because we know they can be toxic in certain doses. Although there have been no deaths reported from most of them, we still keep limits in place. Why? Prevention and safety. We identify a risk and take a what-if approach to be safe.
A giraffe has never escaped from the zoo and wrecked havoc, yet they're still enclosed and tightly monitored just in case. There's a risk of it happening so we eliminate that risk just to be safe.
Genius analogy. Who came first, the giraffe or the zoo? Or do you honestly think that humans never interacted with giraffes before zoos were built?
Why are mastiffs safe to walk on a leash but not leopards? Because one animal is more dangerous and harder to train than the other (despite being smaller). How do we know that? By interacting with them.
Romans built their aqueducts using lead pipes, no one does that anymore because humans have found out the hard way that lead is very poisonous.600khivebent4life posted...600k posted...
Fully transitioned people prefer to be addressed according to the gender they transitioned to. Bradley Manning hasn't fully transitioned and I don't even know if he ever will.
But I don't know why his name has been brought up, he did the leak long before he decided to switch, so his gender is really irrelevant here. He risked his life and freedom to expose US military war crimes (and many more ugly things), that's all what matters.
All transgender people prefer to be addressed as the gender they identify with. Her name is Chelsea. In fact I'm pretty sure she has changed her legal name to that
What if I don't care?600k600k posted...hivebent4life posted...
600k posted...
Fully transitioned people prefer to be addressed according to the gender they transitioned to. Bradley Manning hasn't fully transitioned and I don't even know if he ever will.
But I don't know why his name has been brought up, he did the leak long before he decided to switch, so his gender is really irrelevant here. He risked his life and freedom to expose US military war crimes (and many more ugly things), that's all what matters.
All transgender people prefer to be addressed as the gender they identify with. Her name is Chelsea. In fact I'm pretty sure she has changed her legal name to that
What if I don't care?
Putting aside that you care enough to engage in the debate, your posts contradict each other if in one post you speak for them and tell us what they want and then say you don't care what they want.Trolling is not an etiquite issue. It is harassment.
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